Persona 5: April 21th – May 5th (Downtime + Fallout)

I genuinely thought the resolution might happen immediately this time, but no, once again we have to wait until the deadline to advance the plot regardless of when we complete the objective. What is pacing?

During downtime we’re introduced to a new teacher. I know I said I didn’t want quirky, but he looks about as generic as possible.

Mr. Inui: Do you know the name of the Roman emperor who participated in the Olympics?

Why are Japanese students learning about another nation’s emperor?

I get Ryuji’s next social level, where he finally explains what he should have explained when it was relevant: Kamoshida insulted his parents, so Ryuji punched him, and that’s what got the track team disbanded. This is why everyone blames Ryuji for destroying the track team, which makes sense. What doesn’t make sense is why Ryuji is repeatedly shocked Kamoshida is abusing his students when Ryuji himself directly suffered under Kamoshida’s abuse.

On the 25th Kawakami rants about the students being terrible writers. Just like the game’s writers! On Tuesday we get a scene with Ann.

Ann: I get anxious unless I’m doing something, yet here I am suddenly with nothing to do.

GPOY

Apparently you can give gifts on stopover social link events to make them increase faster. There still shouldn’t be stopover events in the first place, but okay, that’s something.

After four more days of nothing, Ann shows up to fret over if mindraping Kamoshida actually worked. Don’t you know where he lives? You could check on him directly instead of whining about how we can’t do anything. It also occurs to me that Kamoshida said everyone was in on it so we should really be going after the other adults too, but no.

…This is pinging my transphobic caricature alarms. I’d hope I’m wrong, but I think that would be fooling myself.

Ms. Chouno: What’s important is becoming someone else. In this day and age, being able to swap your mask depending on the situation is a critical talent.

Unless you’re most people, in which case you only have one mask, which is also your true self.

On May 2nd the plot finally advances. In the morning we overhear students gossiping about how no one’s taking the calling card seriously. Kamoshida disappeared the very next day, guys. These are the laziest gossips ever.

Brown-Haired Student: What’s with the sudden morning assembly?
Flashy Student: I bet it’s about that girl who jumped the other day.

“The other day”? It’s been two weeks!

Flash Student: There was that weird calling card too, so I guess the teachers are freaking out?

Again, that was over a week ago. Thank you for demonstrating how nonsensical it is to delay the plot like this.

Kamoshida barges in and confesses all his crimes.

Kamoshida: I am the reason why Shiho Suzui tried to kill herself!

So he did know he was the reason, even though his Shadow, who is supposedly his truest self, claimed it was Ann’s fault. He then says he’s going to kill himself, but Ann tells him he has to live for… some reason. So instead he agrees to turn himself in to the police. The students start muttering about if the calling card was for real, and I have to wonder if “stealing hearts” was a translation goof. We didn’t steal his heart, we gave him one. Afterwards, Ryuji once again waffles over if this was really “for the best”. Nothing says this is a game about the necessity of rebellion like whining every five seconds about if the abusive pedophile teacher deserved to have bad things happen to him.

Ryuji: But things are happenin’ way too fast…

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

HA

Mishima shows up to apologize to Ann because

Mishima: We all knew… but we pretended we didn’t.
Tall Student: Takamaki-san, I had you all wrong… I’m sorry that I spread rumors about you!

So you knew, but also you spread rumors because you didn’t know? Or is this more quality localization?

Black-Haired Student: I didn’t know at all…

I’m so glad there’s a third person here to contradict Mishima.

Black-Haired Student: Kamoshida was forcefully pushing himself on you… It must’ve been so hard for you!

It was incredibly obvious that’s what he was doing this whole time. I heard you gossiping about how Ann was such a stone cold bitch for constantly rejecting him. Why does this change anything. Why is everyone so stupid.

Ann: No, it’s okay. The same goes for me too…

What a lovely message about abuse.

Mishima is still covered in bruises even though Kamoshida has been out for two weeks. What, does he punch himself to make up for it?

Mishima [to Damien]: I can’t apologize enough for what I did to you. …I swear I’ll make it up to you someday.

For some reason we do not refute this even though Kamoshida forced him to do it and he already apologized at the time. What, so if someone successfully bullies you into doing something you’re equally culpable? If Ann had let Kamoshida rape her everyone would be right to slut-shame her?

Ryuji: Looks like Kamoshida ain’t the only one that had a change of heart.

YOU WERE THERE WHEN MISHIMA HAD A BREAKDOWN OVER THIS YOU UTTER DICKWAD.

Ann: My thing doesn’t really matter. We made Kamoshida apologize about Shiho… That’s more than enough for me.

And of course the girl has to be perfectly selfless and can’t want anything for herself. Shiho is also still in the hospital and likely crippled for life, plus it’s heavily implied he actually raped her, which cannot be undone by him apologizing, but who cares, girls aren’t people.

The genius phantom thieves are displaying the evidence right out in the open. How is Niijima struggling to compile a case.

Ryuji: And we were lucky his mind didn’t get messed up either!

You just saw his personality do a complete 180 followed by him trying to kill himself and you think his mind didn’t get messed up? The ever-reliable Morgana says this is totally because we negotiated with his Shadow instead of killing it. So next time we should definitely kill the Shadow to confirm that hypothesis, thanks Morgana! Ann then walks over because we were apparently discussing our illegal activities loud enough for people to overhear.

Shiho has regained consciousness. Boy, that’s convenient. So if we had just waited, she would have awakened just in time to testify against Kamoshida and save us all this trouble. Apparently Shiho also didn’t know Ann was flirting with Kamoshida. Do these writers think girls never talk? Shiho’s also going to switch schools to escape everyone gossiping about how she’s used goods. If that was an option, why didn’t she do that earlier?

Everyone once again reiterates that Ann was ~so kind~ for sparing Kamoshida, including her saying she did it for pragmatic reasons followed by the boys ignoring that.

Ryuji: No matter how much of a shitbag he was, finishing him off woulda left a bad aftertaste, huh?

No. I hope he kills himself.

Ryuji manages to ask an actually pertinent question: Why was Kamoshida the only one who generated a Palace? Ever-reliable Morgana handwaves it as “something anyone could have if their heart became warped from their desires.” Okay, but we saw plenty of terrible students in that school, plus the administration was all in on it, did that not warp their hearts?

Ryuji: It’s totally impossible for someone to find out what we did at his Palace.

Unless they overhear you loudmouths, like Ann just did. Ann also says people are spreading rumors that “you got together and threatened Kamoshida with something close to physical violence” and Ryuji acts surprised even though he literally did that. Did Mishima squeal?

Ryuji then reveals he’s pawning the medal on the internet. Oh my god, you idiot. HOW IS NIIJIMA STRUGGLING TO MAKE A CASE.

Afterwards, Morgana finally explains that the medal is a mental construct, not the real one. Really should have explained that at the time, Morgana. Next day Morgana talks about pawning the medal in earshot of Sojiro. Good thing he can’t understand you, idiot. Also, we’re apparently pawning it in person? What was Ryuji looking up, then? You can’t just look up a standard price for fenced goods, that’s not how that works.

We overhear the news report of Kamoshida’s case.

Newscaster: What caused this habitual offender to suddenly confess these heinous crimes to his entire school? The police are hoping that the upcoming interrogations will bring light to this question.

That’s your concern. Not the abuse he committed, not that everyone in the school was covering it up, just that he squealed. I think Damien should torch the entire city at this point.

Sojiro: Things might be getting turbulent at school, but you need to just keep your head down, all right?

That’s your reaction. “A teacher at your school abused students? Don’t rock the boat or else it might inconvenience me, a real person who matters, unlike all those kids.”

Ann: Shiho’s name didn’t come up, right?
Ryuji: Not that I saw. I’d bet they wanted to keep that part quiet.
Ann: I’m so glad…

You’re glad Kamoshida’s worst crime is getting covered up and everyone at the school is facing no consequences for doing so? The implication here is clearly she’s glad that Shiho won’t get unwanted attention, but Jesus does it say some really unflattering things that she would get unwanted attention for being a rape victim. It’s terrible this happened to her, but also if anyone finds out she’ll be a pariah for life, because our society is a misogynistic cesspit. …This also makes me think on how Shiho’s mother decided the solution was to quietly move her to another school rather than press charges. There will be no legal justice or compensation for Shiho.

…And Sojiro makes us clean the cafe, which takes up a whole day. More reasonable than usual, but it’s still infuriating given how awful the time management has been so far. The next day we get Damien’s first chronological meeting with Niijima, who sits down to gossip about the news.

Niijima: People who were living normal lives suddenly went mad or deranged out of the blue…

I thought the official explanation was that he passed out from overwork? Who knows, maybe we’ve switched to a universe where that isn’t true anymore.

NPC: Apparently, a gold medalist got arrested. […] Back in our time, everyone looked up to athletes… But nowadays they’re a bunch of impudent upstarts who are setting a bad example for children.

I assume this is supposed to ironic, but it’s also incoherent. “An athlete got away with doing bad stuff because everyone looked up to him! That’s so different from back in my day when everyone looked up to athletes!”

I have to go to Shibuya to pawn the medal. Along the way Damien encounters a shady dude who’s luring teenagers with the promise of an easy job. Morgana just warns me to stay away. Shouldn’t we be investigating criminals so we can punch their brains out?

Airsoft Manager: We don’t buy any fake or stolen goods here, kid. …Hold on a sec. Lemme see it. … I’m just… not gonna ask where you got this. How’s 30,000 yen for it though?

“I don’t buy stolen goods! Anyway, I won’t ask questions where you got this very identifiable medal after a famous gold medalist just had a breakdown on national TV.” WHO WROTE THIS. Damien should have at least melted it down.

Then Ann calls us about the news report.

Ann: I wonder if we helped those people speak up about it… […] That’s pretty amazing, huh?

We helped them speak up about it after the fact, sure, but I couldn’t help but notice none of the victims on TV mentioned the rest of the school administration was in on it. So no, we did not help anyone speak up about the still-ongoing corruption and abuse. Nor has any adult proposed any proactive measures for preventing this in the future.

Ann: Oh, and did you pawn off that medal?

Does Japan also wiretap everyone’s phones, or is that just a US thing?

The next day Ann takes everyone to a fancy restaurant (but not so fancy they don’t let us take a cat in), and notes that the police are going to be interviewing people at school. Everyone gets worried and normally I’d say that’s dumb because the method is untraceable, but these idiots have been blabbing about their plans in the middle of the street constantly plus texting each other about every detail, so they probably should be concerned. And indeed, they proceed to talk more about how they were totally responsible for what happened to Kamoshida in the middle of a crowded restaurant. Apparently people have also made a fan site for the Phantom Thieves.

AAA localization, everyone.

Ann: “Now I can keep going too”… “Thank you for giving us hope”…

Hope for what? That your abuser will randomly have a breakdown and see the light one day? What about any of this has been applicable to the victims’ lives?

Ann: I was just desperate to deal with my own problems, but seeing people saying all this feels… strange.

You explicitly said you were doing it to avenge Shiho and keep us from getting expelled. I guess she’s considering that her own problem, but this is a bizarre way to phrase it. We were acting selflessly the whole time. This would work so much better if they really were just in it for personal gain, and only now do they realize they can actually do some good. That’s, like, the textbook thief-with-a-heart-of-gold arc. But no. I suppose P4 should have clued me in that these writers have no understanding of the genres they’re referencing.

Ann proceeds to gorge herself on the best dessert, cake, and Ryuji fat-shames her.

Ann: How much do you think one of these costs!? I’ll never get the chance to do this again!

Unless the next Treasure is also insanely valuable.

Morgana: The ingredients and variety of dishes are crazy good. There’s a reason it costs 8000 yen.

Only $80??? That’s pricey, but it’s by no means a once-in-a-lifetime experience. There’s restaurants where I live that charge over $100 for a single dish.

We overhear a couple of wealthy women slumming it in this $80 restaurant. Despite being women who are presumably also sending their kids to prep schools, they’re dismissive of the “tawdry scandal” of a teacher raping kids. Women continue to be the most misogynistic people in this universe. Morgana is somehow shocked that the snooty adults are snooty. At the elevator, we run into the rapist from Damien’s backstory. The game emphasizes this with a flashback and Damien saying he recognizes the voice (twice) because Atlus thinks we’re idiots. This gives Ryuji the shocking revelation that other evil people exist, so he wants us to continue being phantom thieves. Ann is shocked by this, because she apparently planned to just forget she had magic powers she could use to solve problems.

Ryuji: We put a lot of work into changin’ Kamoshida’s heart, but nobody believes in the Phantom Thieves.

Except for the fansite that just popped up praising you like the second coming of Christ.

Ryuji: Plus… those guys who had no other choice but to just deal with it are thankin’ us.

Oh, he immediately points out the plot hole. Thanks?

Damien: I didn’t even think of such a possibility…

The character whose introduction is “I can’t think of any other choice but to help the person in front of me,” didn’t even think of the possibility of helping people? Why did the writers even give him a backstory?

They debate over what to name their group. I thought “Phantom Thieves” was fine…? No one can come up with a good name, so they let the player write one.

The default is… “The Phantoms”. That’s just a truncation of the name Ryuji picked. I presume this was longer in Japanese.

Ann: Who’s our next target?
Ryuji: There are tons of rotten adults and all… …Why not just stick to targeting big names?

You just discovered an ordinary high school teacher was secretly a monster tormenting people you knew and your takeaway is that you should target “big names”. Okay.

Ryuji: If we go after some bigwig, it’s gotta get on the news, right?

Unlike what you just did, which also got on the news…? This is so incoherent. “I wanna be a hero, let’s go after someone big! Because I actually only care about being famous.”

Ann: True. If we become better known… we might be able to give courage to a lot more people.

You know what would make this make sense? If the principal also got in trouble as a result of this. By exposing Kamoshida, we give students the courage to finger all his collaborators and get them thrown behind bars too. Then it would make sense to care about notoriety, because our reputation inspired real change. But we can’t show any real-world solutions to these problems, so our actions only produce vague “hope” that does nothing.

We then get a flash-forward. Is it finally going to be plot-relevant this time? Niijima recaps what we’ve told her and once again says it’s unbelievable.

Niijima: Still, it can’t be considered nonsense when parts of it align with Kamoshida’s confession.

What parts? He made a public confession we witnessed, and then we spun an unverifiable story about how we were totally responsible. That doesn’t mean anything! I’m starting to see why this gullible idiot is struggling to make a case.

…You know, it would be funny if the whole story was actually just a fiction we were spinning to screw with the police. It would be dumb as all “It was all a dream” twists are, but would it really be dumber than what we’ve already seen?

Niijima: These two other accomplices, besides this talking cat thing that appeared in your story… From what you’ve been telling me, they’re students at the same school, aren’t they?

So wait, Damien didn’t give her their names? What has he been telling her, then? Is the flashback not diegetic? Why is the story like this.

Niijima: If you are making this up, the cracks in your story will prove it.

What cracks? We just told you we learned this from a talking cat with magic powers and you still don’t think we’re pulling your leg! We could clearly tell you anything at this point! She then spoils who the next victim is. Thanks, game, that was very necessary.

3 Comments

  1. Gabriulio says:

    Okay, so the whole “stealing hearts” and “change of heart” is a translation thing, in a way. Let me explain.

    First of all, the Japanese word “kokoro,” which is commonly translated as “heart” does not necessarily mean heart. It doesn’t mean the physical heart (that’s “shinzou”) but rather it’s a mixture of emotional heart, mind, will, and spirit. It’s one of those words you can most of the time translate “close enough” but you can’t fully explain its meaning with just a single word. Japanese Wikipedia even calls it highly ambiguous and abstract.

    The group in P5 is called the “Phantom Thieves of Hearts,” with the “Hearts” part being kokoro. By doing so they provoke in their target something called a “change of heart.” But here’s the thing… the word for “change of heart” is the Japanese word “kaishin” which means “reformation/conduct correction” and is composed for the kanji for “change” and kokoro.

    So in the end it’s one of those thing where the localization doesn’t fully convey the original meaning, but also the original meaning is already abstract and hard to translate.

    3
    1. Seed of Bismuth says:

      disposition, sounds close to Kokoro.
      i.e. Scrooge had a long nightmare and awoke with a new disposition.
      but Phantom Thieves of Disposition doesn’t really roll of the tongue.

    2. St. Elmo's Fire says:

      I think “heart” still works pretty well, since English’s metaphorical meaning of “heart” is pretty close to kokoro. I think the only issue is in “change of heart” — if it’s meant to mean more along the lines of “rehabilitation” or “repentance”, they needed to tweak the script to make that more consistent. As it is the script flip-flops a lot between whether the characters are trying to punish, redeem, or mind-control the targets.

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