Another SYOC Horrorshow: “PoKeMoN: DEMON AND ANGEL”

So as you may or may not know, I’ve gotten a bit more up-front with my SYOC reviews: I give a warning about the risks of SYOC and link to the thread, and only submit a character if this doesn’t get me blocked. Back in August, I did this to one SYOC and discovered the author was the most immature manchild I have ever encountered. But in a twist, they actually liked my character, and vowed that they would prove me wrong about SYOC being doomed to failure.

The story is now gone without a trace, but the PM trail is still a worthwhile story in itself.


https://www.fanfiction.net/s/12593617/1/PoKeMoN-D-E-M-O-N-A-N-D-A-N-G-E-L

[As some of you may have figured it out by now, all the 15 OCs will have a starter unique to them – no OCs will have two same starters, of course.]

This is a good idea in theory, but a bad one in practice. It’s not fair to people to have their character rejected for a minor detail just because someone already claimed dibs without their knowledge. If you want very specific character setups like this, you should really be making your own OCs.

[I understand everyone loves and wants strong Pokemon but it’s impossible, especially for young Academy students, to have a team of incredibly strong pseudo-legendaries or Dragons. Yes, you can have a personal fascination for a single type but you also have to see how rare they are – amassing a full Dragon Party will take you a few years at the least. I want to see a balance of what people consider “weak, common Pokemon” and “strong” Pokemon so I’m limiting pseudo-legendaries to one in a party (this includes Dragonite, Tyranitar, Salamence, Metagross, Garchomp and Hydreigon) and Dragon types to two in a party.]

This is the wrong way of approaching this. If you need a specific power level for the characters to work in the story, you don’t need to make any compromises or concessions to the people with overpowered Mary Sues, and in fact it’s a lot clearer and easier if you say straight-up what power bracket you want. From there, the onus should be on the submitters to justify their level within that bracket. It’s possible to justify having an overpowered pokemon with backstory, or counterbalance it with some disadvantage like disobedience or a major character flaw in the trainer themselves.

[Ashworthe Academy is the most respected and elite Pokemon Academy in the whole region]

This, too, limits character possibilities to an unreasonable extreme. You say you want diverse and imperfect characters, but there aren’t a lot of ways to build “child prodigy suma cum laude”, and a lot of them are probably going to look like Mary Sues – either they got the highest position in the country legitimately, in which case they’re a supergenius, or they got it despite huge disadvantages, in which case they’re absurdly lucky.

[The top 15 students will be divided into five groups of three members each and leave on different routes – however, each student will have the same goal. Collect eight badges and take the League challenge – the top four finalists will battle the Elite Four and the winners will then proceed to battle each other before finally making it to the Champion. The teams will have to travel on their journey together and will be out of the competition if they leave their team or travel alone.]

Nor does your plot give us anything interesting to engage with or leverage. The standard badge quest is not a plot. It’s interesting in the games because gameplay milestones are inherently interesting in a game. It’s not the same in a story. Recall how many sideplots the anime introduced. This has a much deeper explanation: fanfiction (d o t) net/topic/11834/143219856/1/Actually-Writing-an-OT-Fic-Part-1

Perhaps you are going to have some interesting twist on the formula, but if you are, you need to tell your submitters that. You can’t withhold information from the people who are going to be populating the story, that’s just going to get you boring and unsuitable characters.

From this and everything else (especially the extremely detailed submission forms), it really sounds like you have specific ideas for what kinds of characters you want and should be making the characters yourself, especially when this is set in your own special region that nobody knows anything about other than what you’ve chosen to share (which isn’t enough, in the same way there’s a world of difference between reading about a country in a pamphlet and actually living there). I strongly recommend reading this thread: fanfiction (d o t) net/topic/11834/142912324/1/Stop-Asking-For-OCs

[Orientals]

Also, this term is considered racially insensitive to a lot of people. “Asian” is more accepted.

[The land of Novus is a vast and highly diverse land located between Unova and Kalos]

…So it’s Spain, then? Look at a map of Kalos. It’s literally France. Real-world geography seems to hold constant for the pokeworld.

Finally: Non-story chapters are banned on this site. You need to include some story content. This is doubly important in a SYOC, because a page of plot and themes is worth an encyclopedia of setting information. In a good story, characters and plot are deeply interwoven, but you can’t get that in a SYOC if submitters have no idea what the plot is.

re: Your review to PoKeMoN: D E M O N A N D A N G E L
Aug 2Queen Junior
A response to your review at https://www.fanfiction.net/r/12593617/

Oh my, I was waiting for you!!! TT-TT I’d become scared you wouldn’t come but you’ve made me really happy now by showing up!!! ^^

“This is a good idea in theory, but a bad one in practice. It’s not fair to people to have their character rejected for a minor detail just because someone already claimed dibs without their knowledge. If you want very specific character setups like this, you should really be making your own OCs.”

Oh dear, looks like you haven’t properly read everything – well, it’s not your fault, regarding how many details there were!! :) The Starter Selection only commences AFTER the 15 spots are filled – so I won’t be rejecting any one’s OCs because of something so contrite!!! Don’t worry, the people here are really nice and I’m not that cruel~!!!!

“This is the wrong way of approaching this. If you need a specific power level for the characters to work in the story, you don’t need to make any compromises or concessions to the people with overpowered Mary Sues, and in fact it’s a lot clearer and easier if you say straight-up what power bracket you want. From there, the onus should be on the submitters to justify their level within that bracket. It’s possible to justify having an overpowered pokemon with backstory, or counterbalance it with some disadvantage like disobedience or a major character flaw in the trainer themselves.”

Now, now, wrong and right are merely points of view, isn’t it? Well, I would completely respect your idea if it fit into the frames of a story YOU wrote and flowed along with its plot progression and eased things for you. However, the ‘wrong way’ I have actually isn’t wrong if you look at it through a wider scope and is merely something I and I’m sure MOST other writers would agree is easier and more comfortable. That’s just my view there but then again, it is MY story and none of the OC senders have any problems with it so it’s fair to say it’s justified. :)

“This, too, limits character possibilities to an unreasonable extreme. You say you want diverse and imperfect characters, but there aren’t a lot of ways to build “child prodigy suma cum laude”, and a lot of them are probably going to look like Mary Sues – either they got the highest position in the country legitimately, in which case they’re a supergenius, or they got it despite huge disadvantages, in which case they’re absurdly lucky.”

Hohoho, I understand why you’d want to debate this point but then again, you’re speaking from an extremely narrow mindset. There are different kinds of ‘prodigies’, dear sir/maam – the ones with talent, the ones with luck, the ones with hard work, the ones with passion, the ones with backup, the ones with quick wits and LOOOOOTTTTSSSS more. That gives plenty of variety and since Ashthorne Academy is the main pinnacle of the story’s lore and the center of its plot progression, the OCs have to be rather intimately connected to it. I would tell you in greater detail but then that’d spoil the story for you, ne~?

Oh, and they may be top 15 of Novus’ most elite Academy but then again, they’ve got no ‘real’ battling experience so there’s plenty of hardships they’ll go through.

“[The top 15 students will be divided into five groups of three members each and leave on different routes – however, each student will have the same goal. Collect eight badges and take the League challenge – the top four finalists will battle the Elite Four and the winners will then proceed to battle each other before finally making it to the Champion. The teams will have to travel on their journey together and will be out of the competition if they leave their team or travel alone.]”

Ohohoho, but if the plot gave away everything from the onset, wouldn’t there be absolutely no surprise and shock factor to the show? XD I haven’t even posted anything of the plot yet!!! This is just world info!!! Oh, and what is that link? Are you getting paid for promoting it or something? If so, then I can totally understand why you’re working so hard to flaunt it!! XD Keep at it!!! *thumbs up*

“Perhaps you are going to have some interesting twist on the formula, but if you are, you need to tell your submitters that. You can’t withhold information from the people who are going to be populating the story, that’s just going to get you boring and unsuitable characters.”

This is absolutely NOT true at all!! XD I’ve received many interesting characters with many interesting details that makes it easy to include them into a lot of side plots. ;) Again, if I revealed everything from the onset, it’d just be boring and no shock factor!! What’s even the purpose of reading a story, then? I might as well write a 1000 word summary on it. XP

“From this and everything else (especially the extremely detailed submission forms), it really sounds like you have specific ideas for what kinds of characters you want and should be making the characters yourself, especially when this is set in your own special region that nobody knows anything about other than what you’ve chosen to share (which isn’t enough, in the same way there’s a world of difference between reading about a country in a pamphlet and actually living there). I strongly recommend reading this thread: fanfiction (d o t) net/topic/11834/142912324/1/Stop-Asking-For-OCs”

Oh, another link and this one is so much more insensitive!! XD Nope, I don’t have ‘specific ideas’ for OCs – I just want them to be detailed. If you’ll read carefully (which you prove you haven’t) there’s a LOTTTTTTT of options they can choose from for anything and I have provided NO LIMITATIONS whatsoever to them in ANY FORM OF WAY. They’re incredibly free with their OCs and the quality OCs I’ve been receiving have proved this. ;) And why, nobody else seems to have a problem with the information they’ve received!!! I’m always here to answer any and all questions so please stop assuming things which have no justification at all, okay? XD

“Also, this term is considered racially insensitive to a lot of people. “Asian” is more accepted.”

Looking at things that way, I find it racially insensitive because Asians encompass A LOT OF RACES – South-east Asians, Orientals, Middle Easterns etc. XD Orientals are a race and frankly, I’ve got a lot of friends who don’t find it insensitive at all. Hmmm, maybe some people are just more short-wired, ne?

“…So it’s Spain, then? Look at a map of Kalos. It’s literally France. Real-world geography seems to hold constant for the pokeworld.”

Oh, it is? I totally didn’t know that!! *hugs* Thank you for the info!! :D

“Finally: Non-story chapters are banned on this site. You need to include some story content. This is doubly important in a SYOC, because a page of plot and themes is worth an encyclopedia of setting information. In a good story, characters and plot are deeply interwoven, but you can’t get that in a SYOC if submitters have no idea what the plot is.”

Ah, yes, another one of my good reviewers told me so too!!! Don’t worry, a Prologue is on the way!!!

By the way, thank you so much for the review!!! However, I was expecting an intelligent debate but I was let down by the baseless and unjustified assumptions and facts. Oh, never mind~!! :D Would you like to try sending an OC?

Aug 2You really don’t need to pretend to be nice. It’s just tiring.

I’m basing my views on years of experience with SYOC. I’ve seen countless stories just like this one crash and burn for the exact reasons I and Farla have described. If you don’t want to heed my warnings, that’s your decision, but don’t act like I’m doing this out of baseless arrogance. I’m doing this because I want you to succeed.

If you’re determined to go ahead with this, I will see about submitting an OC.

Aug 2It’s more tiring for me than you.

I’ve been in your shoes but that doesn’t mean that I will discourage every single writer writing SYOCs to leave them. I know most SYOCs have crashed and fallen somewhere in a ditch but I’m not letting my story be the same. I will complete this even if I need to write a 100 chapters. Please tell that to Miss Farla too.

I apologize if I appeared too rude but I was a little agitated due to my love for SYOCs.

I’ll be looking forward to your OC if there’s still space left.

Aug 2[It’s more tiring for me than you.]

Then why do it?

Aug 2Sometimes you have to do the tiring stuff to accomplish something.
Aug 2What were you trying to accomplish, then?

Aug 2Justification. Closure. The truth.

Because you seemed to have a personal distaste for SYOCs.

Aug 2I fail to see how an obviously false tone helps bring us closer to “the truth”. This would have been a lot clearer and easier if you were straightforward with me from the start.
Aug 2I wasn’t being false. I was trying to be polite. I don’t believe in being ‘straightforward’ until I get my facts clear and straight. But yes, I agree, the falseness was on purpose. I got ignored the last time I was straightforward with you.

Aug 2In what universe is mockery anywhere near the ballpark of “polite”? Being straightfoward is how you get your facts clear and straight. You learn the truth by asking people in good faith, not being by attacking them based on your initial assumptions.

When was the last time you were straightforward with me? Did I review you before?

Aug 2And yet, that is clearly what you did during the review. I know I wasn’t the most polite of people (I couldn’t be completely polite after all you said) but so weren’t you. You need to show good faith to receive it, sir.

. . . . . I contacted you with a PM last week. But never mind.

Aug 2I was absolutely acting in good faith. Good does not mean nice. You had all the hallmarks of a doomed story, and did a few specific things I particularly disagreed with. To obfuscate my feelings and not warn you from what I believe to be a doomed path, that would be acting in bad faith. I was completely open about my feelings and opinions, so yes, I very much can expect the same in return.

I have no record of any other PMs from you. It probably got lost in the Matrix, as things on this terrible site are wont to do. Try sending it again.

Aug 2A ‘doomed story’ according to your books, right? But there are many who disagree and support me and my story. I will not let them down.
Being open is one thing – being discouraging and assuming is another.
Okay, I’ll lay my cards on the table.
I very much plan to continue this SYOC and complete it cause I have a terrific idea using other people’s OCs. So I would very much appreciate if it were not to be surrounded by baseless negativity – I’ll welcome plot, character, build up, pace, grammatical and other constructive criticism with open arms but I won’t tolerate negativity because it is an SYOC.
Thank you.Never mind.
PDA OCs: Havan D’Rath, and others

Aug 2Stage I – Basic Information

Name: Havan D’Rath

Age: 16

Ethnicity: Asian

Gender: Male

Sexuality: Whatever.

Academy Year: Senior

Stage II – Appearance

Height and Weight: A head taller than most people. Slightly heavy for his age (but most of it’s muscle!).

Hair Colour and Style: Platinum blond. His hair is close-cropped, and combed back for a highly professional look. There are no stray hairs or split ends; he is fastidious in his hair care.

Eyes: Icy blue. His eyes are always wide and attentive, with a deep, calculating intelligence behind them. They look oddly small on his face; they might be described as “beady” on someone who wasn’t so handsome.

Skin Colour: Pale, but slightly tanned. He’s no shut-in; he’s had plenty of practical, outdoors experience!

Body Type: Total hunk. He strikes a careful balance in his appearance: just enough muscle to look strong and capable, but not enough to look like some dumb, coarse bruiser. He has a healthy amount of fat, but nothing significantly noticeable. He didn’t get this way without significant effort; to maintain it, he must watch his diet like a hawk and schedule regular workout times. (People who take lunch with him might find it odd how lightly he eats — he mostly eats salads, and workout food when he needs heavier nutrients. No worries, though. He can easily deflect suspicions of weirdness by convincing everyone his diet is normal and healthy.)

Facial Structure: Attractively round and full. He is always clean-shaven, and looks older and more mature than he is. He has an average-sized, unobtrusive nose, smooth cheeks, and beautiful teeth that compliment his charming smile. They all help distract from how disquieting his eyes are.

Seiyuu and Speech Pattern: His voice is a pleasant baritone, and sounds mature for his age. He’s trained in theater and has excellent control of his voice as a result. He also tends to have a flamboyant, dramatic way of speaking, like he’s a hero in a play — he especially likes to do this when he can cast himself as a noble hero against a terrible villain. He’ll take the hint if people find this grating, but even if circumstances require him to tone it down, he’ll be very eloquent. He does have a noticeable Johtoan accent, however, and despite his best efforts he can’t seem to shake it. For voice, I’m not familiar with Japanese actors, but Chris Evans is probably a good fit?

Body Markings: Good heavens, no! He’d never to anything so delinquent as getting a tattoo! Those are forever, you know! And he’d never do anything so risky it would give him a scar! (Actually he used to have some scars, from general scrapes when he was a kid. He used scar removal treatments to get rid of them, and now his body is flawless again.)

Signature Outfit: Havan doesn’t really have a “signature outfit” — the clothes make the man, after all, and you so often need to be different men for different occasions. If you mean the outfit you want him introduced in, then: a business casual starched shirt, pastel blue, with tasteful navy blue pants. Perhaps the shirt has some stripes of slightly darker blue — nothing too ostentatious, though. This communicates his crisp sense of professionalism and self-respect without looking like he’s trying too hard or alienating the other students. Does the school crowd not like that kind of outfit? Well then, he should have different one. It’ll probably be different depending on who he’s hanging out with. Maybe something more formal if he’s meeting with a teacher (baby blue blazer, navy blue trousers), maybe something flashier if he’s with the preppy kids (a bright, in-your-face blue, with some red or yellow for contrast), maybe some brand trash if he’s slumming with the normal kids (a T-shirt featuring a gallade or gardevoir, his favorite pokemon). Whatever makes them feel comfortable. He always aims to please!

Alternate Outfit: On the road, he’ll dress extremely practically. Sturdy boots, hiker shorts, a survival jacket with a million pockets. You won’t catch him without a raincoat, even on a sunny day. He might even bring a kevlar vest — never know when a pokemon encounter might go bad. He’ll replace his clothes if they get torn or stained but this time, aesthetics will take a back seat. Caring about fashion in a life-or-death situation will just make you look like an idiot. Here, practicality is what people respect.

Winter Outfit: He’s unusually sensitive to cold. He’ll wear a padded vest even indoors, and has a full set of gloves, boots, hand and leg warmers, and heavy jacket when he goes outdoors. The gloves and jacket are dark blue, with some gold highlights to make them stand out. The vest is sky-blue. When he enters a building, he’ll strip off the outer layers as soon as possible to prevent sweat and grime buildup.

Accessories: He has a badge displaying every region’s national crest. He’ll default to Johto, but will swap it out as necessary. He also wears a pendant bearing an image of Ho-oh. Naturally, he’ll box these if he’s meeting with someone who thinks accessories are gross and tacky.

Aug 2Stage III – Background

Home Town: Goldenrod City; immigrated to Toke O City.

Background: Havan was born in Johto. Havan’s parents were wealthy, and they gave him everything he asked for. What he loved the most were stories. In a region like that, history permeates everything, and he was endlessly fascinated by it all. Mew, who gave birth to the world. Lugia, who tore the sea asunder. Ho-oh, the glorious phoenix who could defy death itself, who in Her infinite mercy brought the three great beasts back to life. And it was all real. He visited the Bell Tower, saw the ash-caked statues himself, gazed upon myth.

And then, the he looked towards the future. For one day, his parents said, Ho-oh will return, and as She rises from Her ashes so too will rise a chosen one, a righteous hero to lead the world into a golden age.

He wanted to be a part of those stories more than anything. To have that beauty, that glory. That power.

That, sadly, his parents could not give him. But no matter. With hard work and perseverance, nothing is beyond your grasp. He was a little disappointed by the move to Novus, saddened to say goodbye to all that living history, but this, too was an opportunity. Their academy was one of the most prestigious in the world — and at 11, he had already gone on a pokemon journey, giving him enough experience to pass the entry exams with flying colors. If he rose through the ranks, he could do anything.

Or so he thought. He took too long! While he wasted his time learning things he already knew in this stifling school, children — CHILDREN! — swept the world clean out from under him! Look at them, the papers crooned! “PRODIGY FROM PALLET BESTS MYSTERIOUS MAN-MADE POKEMON!” “HOENN’S NEW CHAMPION AVERTS APOCALYPSE THROUGH ALLIANCE WITH LONG-LOST SKY GOD!” “EXCLUSIVE FEATURE: CREATORS OF TIME AND SPACE, SO TAME THEY EAT OUT OF YOUR HAND! IS THIS THE ‘DAWN’ OF A NEW ERA?” And worst of all — Lyra, that cunning little minx, somehow tricked Ho-oh into choosing HER! Oh, sure, the stories say the gods chose them because they were so pure of heart, but Havan knows the truth. They just played the part, said the right words, did whatever people wanted, and wrapped everyone around their fingers. This chosen one stuff, it’s all arbitrary, just some hoops to jump through, like the academy exams. He just has to be ready when the time comes.

He lives in the dorms.

Significant Relationships:

Santes D’Rath – Doctor, former trainer – Mother

Santes is a bright and cheerful woman, possessed of a youthful vigor despite her age. She has a whimsical, jubilant personality and is quick to crack jokes and make conversation. She is a brilliant doctor, and always tries to help those in need. Some find her enthusiasm tiring or overbearing, and she either does not notice this… or does not care. In truth, she is a little self-absorbed. She loves her son dearly, but can’t always spend as much time with him as she likes.

She met Havan’s father on her pokemon journey. She says it was love at first sight.

Zargos D’Rath – Historical scholar, former trainer – Father

Zargos is an unlikely match for Santes; perhaps opposites really do attract. He is a quiet and reserved man, though when he is roused to anger, he is a terror to behold. He’s a surprisingly competitive trainer, but chose to settle down after he married Santes. His love now lies in the rich history and mythology of Johto, which he takes great pride in. (To the point of arrogance, truth be told — he would never consciously admit it, but there is an undercurrent of racism to his interactions with others. Johtoans are just better, you know?) He provided Havan with many of the stories and mythologies that he loves so dearly, but he is a somewhat absent presence himself. Not to the point of neglect, but he just prefers an afternoon with a good book to an afternoon fishing with his son. Havan doesn’t mind; he’s a private person himself.

Aug 2Stage IV – Personal

Personality: Havan is the perfect knight in shining armor. He’s very kind, helpful, and charming to everyone he meets. He acts like the world is a grand play, with himself in center stage. He loves playing the hero, and he’ll always volunteer to help people with their problems, even if there’s only one person to see it. He cares deeply about his appearance and reputation and is highly receptive to criticism. Despite this, he’s far from stupid or reckless. He’s not out to get himself killed in some stupid grand gesture.

And speaking of heroism, he knows – just knows – that he’s destined for great things. If your story features any any destined plot triggers, he’ll know he’s part of it, and will actively seek out more. He will, however, be highly suspicious of anyone doing the same. Oh, sure, they’re doing this out of the goodness of their hearts – and he’s sure the fact they’re getting a god’s favor in the process doesn’t cross their minds at all. Who do they think they’re fooling? They want something. They’re just in it for the praise, the power, the reward. They’re just playing the long con. Don’t trust them. Don’t trust anyone.

When interacting with others, Havan is extremely friendly and approachable. He oozes confidence and control, and acts very mature for his age. He’s quick to find out what makes people tick and how to get along with them, and is particularly good at buttering up people of importance and milking them for favors. Even if he doesn’t like people personally, if he believes an alliance would be beneficial he’ll do whatever it takes to ingratiate himself with them. He’ll keep negative thoughts to himself and will mediate conflicts to keep everything running smoothly; he’ll say whatever he thinks people want to hear, even if this requires some contradictory logic. He’s not stupid, though, and won’t blatantly change mannerisms in front of people; he’ll prefer to spin the situation later in private so everyone still thinks he’s on their side. He sees all interactions as opportunities, and as a consequence exists in a tangled web of masks and alliances that leaves him with no true friends. He doesn’t mind, though. All that matters is the goal.

You better watch out, though: he takes betrayal very personally, and if he believes he’s been wronged or cheated in some way, he’ll become quite aggressive in seeking vengeance. Anything that obstructs him will evoke similar indignation; he is highly determined, and will stop at nothing to achieve his goals. Despite this, he will try to maintain a good image even when angry, and perform most of his confrontations out of the public eye; he has a knack for spinning things to make himself look better.

Havan also has a strange quirk: he doesn’t like other people touching his stuff. He’s very possessive of his possessions, and hoards items he really should have gotten rid of by now, like minor potions he picked up while traveling. If confronted on this, he’ll just say “But what if I need them later?” The exception to this is if someone else needs them; he will magnanimously provide innocent bystanders with anything they need, provided it is within his capabilities.

He’s been slipping recently, though. The other heroes’ victories have made him antsy and impatient. He knows he just has to wait a little longer, but dark thoughts are starting to prey on his mind. What if he’s never chosen? What if he never gets anything, despite all his hard work? If this is taken from him too — if someone else defeats Tasha — he will completely snap. He is not above murder for such a betrayal.

Quotes: “I would gladly give my life for my country… no, for all mankind!”

“Well met, friend! Can I help you with anything?”

“No, I couldn’t accept anything — helping those in need is reward enough!” (Note: he will only do this once. If the other person insists, he will graciously accept.)

“Oh, so you think you’re so much better than me, do you? Let me guess, you’re going to say you did this for the good of the world? To protect the innocent? Or, oh, oh, how about ‘Waah, I have a tragic backstory, take pity on me!’ That’s always a classic! But it’s a LIE. You aren’t standing here because of goodness or virtue or mercy. You’re here because you want POWER. Because that’s the only thing that matters! That’s the only thing anyone respects! How DARE you look at me, like you’re DIFFERENT, like you’re not only here because of DUMB LUCK, like you DESERVE this! I… HATE you!!”

Bad/Unusual Habits: He can’t help but pick at things, be they erasers, scuff marks in wood, or his own scabs and pimples.

Likes: Fame, glory, excitement, WINNING. The color blue. Stories. Theater. He respects dedication and determination in others. He also has a sweet tooth, but he barely ever indulges now that he has to keep up his superhero physique.

Dislikes: Not getting what he deserves. People stealing his spotlight. Other “heroes”. Winter.

Goals: To be the very best! Like no one ever was. He’ll be content (for now) with taming a god pokemon and making the international papers.

Fears: Losing, failure, oblivion. And it’s not a “fear” exactly, but he doesn’t like staring at his own reflection. Something about it disturbs him.

Disorders: Narcissism.

Secrets: Absolutely none. He doesn’t think that what he’s doing is a deep dark secret, or that it’s even wrong. He genuinely believes that this is what it means to be a hero.

Ability: Silver-tongued. He is a social genius, capable of swaying just about anyone to his side.

Aug 2Stage VI – Behavioural Questions

OC’s behaviour with his/her Pokemon: He keeps them at arms’ length. He won’t mistreat them or anything, but pokemon are tools, not people. If they’re even capable of having real opinions — doubtful! — they’re not as important as his own.

OC’s behaviour with other Pokemon: If it seems like people expect him to interact with their pokemon, he’ll go through the motions. He won’t acknowledge them otherwise. Pokemon he wants to catch he will hunt to the ends of the earth, and ruthlessly. Legendaries, he will treat with reverence.

OC’s behaviour with the other students: I believe this has been covered rather extensively.

OC’s behaviour towards wins: Pleased, but polite. He will always congratulate his opponent on a good battle.

OC’s behaviour towards losses: Graceful; there are seldom serious consequences for it, after all. He’ll examine his strategy for flaws and try to improve for next time.

OC’s behaviour towards crushes: Extremely possessive, but extremely convincing; a Nice Guy with chillingly good manipulative skills. I would pity the object of his affections. He may not have a crush at all, though; it’s a lot of work for something unrelated to his main goal.

OC’s behaviour towards love rivals: If it doesn’t appear that his crush is interested in the rival, he won’t be terribly bothered, but may tell them to back off if they become a problem. If they are a real threat, he will pull strings to remove them from the equation, possibly even getting them expelled. He won’t stoop to murder, but is not above manufacturing a crippling accident if it seems there is no other option. If any of this starts to backfire, though, he will leave it alone. A crush isn’t worth jeopardizing everything he’s worked for.

OC’s behaviour towards admirers: Always polite, but the specific reaction will depend on the person. If he thinks they might be useful, he may lead them on and leverage their affection for favors. Otherwise, he will probably turn them down to avoid complications.

OC’s behaviour towards Esther: Beneath his notice. Bottom of the class AND a depressive wreck? No way is someone like that going to be competition. He can’t even get anything useful out of her — the connection to the chairman is intriguing, but he doesn’t seem to think highly of her, so using her to get an in seems unlikely. He’d be better off focusing his attention elsewhere. He’ll be polite to her if they run into each other, of course, but he finds her self-pitying attitude grating and will not want to be around her for extended periods of time. He won’t stoop to gossiping about her with others, though; he can tell what a bad idea that is. (If she ultimately wins the whole thing, he will freak extra hard. It will be everything he hates: a pathetic nobody getting chosen over him for seemingly no reason. The irony that this is exactly how hero narratives are supposed to work will be lost on him.)

Extra Information: He’s based on player behavior in jRPGs. Do with this information what you will.

Aug 2My second character will depend on how the story will go down. Will a character completely uninterested in the journey assignment be suitable for the story?

Aug 2ACCEPTED. He’s too amazing a character for me to pass up – EASILY one of the best I’ve received yet. I love his narcissism, I love his Janus personality, I love his background, his motivations, his EVERYTHING. I’m not letting him GO anywhere. To say I’m impressed would be an understatement. I’m very, VERY impressed.

If you can create such amazing characters, why don’t you support SYOCs?! Havan is a treasure. However, there’s some things I need to be clear on –

1.) In the story, the Johto Champion is Ethan and not Lyra.
2.) For his voice actor, listen to some clips of the following people – Yuki Kaji, Hiroshi Kamiya, Takahiro Sakurai, Jun Fukuyama and Tetsuya Kakihara. Tell me if you like one of them or I can give you more suggestions.
3.) You can now create his battling strategy and Pokemon team (excluding the Starter). Add the remaining 5 Pokemon of his main team (personality, gender, abilities and food habits) and if he has any extra Pokemon for any purpose. (By the way, Azurill, Zubat and Magnemite lines are off-limit now)
4.) I wanna discuss his Ability a bit more later.

And yeah. If the OC is a part of the top 15 (which they will of course be), they’ll be pretty much forced to go on that journey.

Aug 2[In the story, the Johto Champion is Ethan and not Lyra.]

Why?

Aug 2To even out the gender ratio. XD

Kanto, Johto and Unova Champions are boys (Red, Ethan and Hilbert)
Hoenn, Sinnoh and Novus Champions are girls (May, Dawn and Tasha)

Aug 2Okay, that’s fair.

All the clips I can find of the voice actors have them in very inflected/emotional scenes, which makes it hard to judge, and it’s really hard to distinguish voices in a foreign language anyway. Pick whichever one sounds most generically heroic to you.

[If you can create such amazing characters, why don’t you support SYOCs?!]

I’ll tell you when the story finishes.

[they’ll be pretty much forced to go on that journey]

Define “forced”. Like, will they be clapped in chains? The character I have in mind just wants to explore and sightsee, and doesn’t care about winning the competition.

Aug 2Then I’ll pick Yuki Kaji because he has the highest number of male lead roles amongst them. And also because he’s voice suits Havan a lot.

That’ll take at least 3 years but okay.

They will be subtly threatened and tempted with rewards. But if that’s your character’s goal, not necessary.

Aug 2Alright. Havan’s pokemon first:

Stage V – Pokemon

Starter: I’m leaning towards a charmander for this. The personality will be the same regardless: As a lab-raised pokemon, they had very little contact with the outside world until Havan came along, and they are eternally grateful that he gave them a purpose. Born and raised for battle, they’re highly skilled and intelligent, but this can make her come off as snobbish and aloof towards other pokemon. They are the only pokemon remaining of Havan’s original team.

Pokemon No. 2: Gardevoir. Her name is Deference. Havan calls her Athena. She is an emotional cripple who has extreme difficulty formulating her own thoughts and desires. The latest in a line of several gardevoirs, Havan has finally found one that will put up with being treated like an attack dog without turning out to secretly be a psycho that causes a huge scene and gets him in trouble etc. etc. pokemon are such a hassle. This one is perfectly obedient and extremely loyal even for a gardevoir, and… has no real personality outside of that. Other psychics find her emotions noticeably dulled, and she claims to have no goals or desires outside of serving Havan. Other pokemon find this creepy.

Pokemon No. 3: Stoutland. His name is Ate All the Sitrus Berries. Havan calls him Fenrir. In the wild, he lived a rather carefree life, but he has adjusted well to life under Havan, and has grown very loyal. Several months of conditioning have made him remarkably well-behaved for a stoutland.

Pokemon No. 4: Machamp. His name is Stares-At-Grass. Havan calls him Hercules. He was captured, raised in the service industry, traded to make him evolve, traded back, then traded across countless other companies and trainers until finally ending up with Havan. A lifetime of being treated as a tool has made him numb to everything, and he is flawlessly obedient. However, he doesn’t interact with anyone else much or really at all. He finds the motion of grass in the wind to be soothing. Sometimes he wishes he could just sit down and watch the rhythm of life flow through the fields and forests. Sometimes he wishes he didn’t have to lift or break or fight anything. But only sometimes. It hurts to wish for things you can’t have.

Pokemon No. 5: Sylveon, “Titania”. Her full, official name is Titania VIII, representing how many generations of eevees Havan had to breed before finding the right one. This one is perfectly happy to be a sylveon and has no resentment towards Havan for planning out her entire life in advance, unlike some ungrateful wastes of time who will not be mentioned. She is a fantastic fighter bred from good stock, but generations of selective breeding have left her a little soft in the head, and she’s rather dependent on Havan to guide her through life. As an egg-raised pokemon, she has no concept of life outside of serving Havan. Sometimes she wonders why she doesn’t look like Daddy, but then he gives her an order and the thought is lost.

Pokemon No. 6: Dratini. Her name is Light. Havan calls her Leviathan. Havan was ecstatic to find an opening on the international market, and bought her earlier this year for quite a hefty sum. He probably should have read the fine print, though: this one was caught, not hatched, and she’s not happy about it. She’s very confused by what’s happening and very much wants to go home. She sees no reason why she should obey this strange human.

Extra Pokemon: Havan has had to… let some pokemon go in the past. He’s had to change his team every year so far due to disobedience, accidents, and in one case, the pokemon outright running away. It was frustrating for a while, but he thinks he’s finally settled on a winning team. Currently, he has still managed to retain the services of a pidgeot, for flying, and a chansey, for healing and first aid.

Battling Strategy: Flashy, but by-the-book. He likes to make a show of things, and may spend resources or time to provide a greater spectacle (or just an outcome that makes him look better). He’s very skilled, however, and can fight with ruthless efficiency when image isn’t an issue.

Aug 3Okay, I understand but there are some problems we have faced.

NO.1
Umm, change his team? The story clearly mentions that the OCs could not have EVER caught a Pokemon in the wild before. This is gonna be their first journey AND first time catching Pokemon.

NO.2
Sylveon does not exist (yet) because the Pokemon available are only up to Generation V. There’s no Fairy Type Pokemon but a Fairy Type Gym. Strange, huh? Well, don’t worry, cause it’s all a part of the plot. But yes – you’ll need to exchange Titania with someone else.That’s all I guess.

Aug 3Oh, and I’ll need the Pokemon abilities too.

Aug 3[The story clearly mentions that the OCs could not have EVER caught a Pokemon in the wild before.]

Where? Regardless, that’s absurd. There are preschoolers with pokemon. Kids catching pokemon is clearly the norm, not the exception. I’m also going to have to balk at the idea that the school for the most prestigious prodigies of the prestige would not only deny applicants with actual field experience but not give even seniors the opportunity to catch their own pokemon. 11 year olds who went on a journey instead of staying in school are going to run rings around these graduates.

But if all their pokemon have to be bought or hatched, his gardevoir is hatched. The eevee can be an umbreon… same name, I guess, since the line between fairies and demons is pretty blurry.

I don’t care about abilities and really, neither should you. This is a story, not a video game. It should be less mechanical, not more. As the writer you know what specific situations the characters will be getting into and what abilities will produce the most interesting outcomes, so I leave such details up to you.

Aug 3You clearly haven’t read the story thoroughly but it does clearly state that the OCs will be going on their FIRST journey and their FIRST Pokemon ever officially owned by them would be their starter. Each and every region is different and this is one of the many ways Novus is different – you cannot go on a Pokemon journey before getting a signed document from a certified Academy. Battles are held in the school for field practice but those are done using the Academy’s Pokemon and they don’t belong to the students.
And it’s not absurd in terms of realistic terms. Would your parents allow you to go on a journey across unknown, different cities as an 11 year old with animals? Well, most parents wouldn’t. I know it’s a thing in the Pokemon franchise but my story is “different.” In many ways.And no, you DO have to catch your Pokemon although they can be also bought, hatched and be gifted.Abilities are hardly technical – they in fact nuance the story more. And I’m sorry for not being a writer who views the same point as you but they’re required in my story. Oh, and you can give any fitting ability to your Pokemon – I’ll cook up interesting outcomes for all of them.. . . . You are serious about your participation, right?

Aug 3[You clearly haven’t read the story thoroughly but it does clearly state that the OCs will be going on their FIRST journey and their FIRST Pokemon ever officially owned by them would be their starter.]

Oh okay, end of the first section, I see it now. Can’t believe I missed that, I would have given you hell for it. I’ll just have to make up for lost time:

[And it’s not absurd in terms of realistic terms. Would your parents allow you to go on a journey across unknown, different cities as an 11 year old with animals?]

Evidently they would if we were in the Pokemon universe. Clearly, the pokeworld isn’t as dangerous as our own. It doesn’t matter how strange a fictional cultural value looks from our standpoint, this is objectively how it works in this world. There has to be an internal logic to every fantasy setting — that is their “realistic”. Rampantly injecting our “realistic” is going to look unrealistic in the context of the world. There’s no way you can convince me Novus isn’t the laughingstock of the world if this is what its best trainers look like. Even the Unovan and Kalosian kids, who start older, will have a leg up on the graduates by the time they’re the seniors’ age. Practical knowledge is more important than theoretical knowledge, in every field, every time.

Look, I don’t know how old you are, but if you’ve ever done an internship for a technical field, you will know exactly what I’m talking about. It doesn’t matter how good your school is or what you think you know. Actually applying your knowledge is a totally different skill you have to build separately. When I first entered a real lab I was a complete buffoon — even though I took lab courses! My teachers had told me what a lab looked like and what all the tools were and common techniques used. I still had to put in a lot of practice (and constantly badger my supervisor with questions) before I could work efficiently, and I’m still learning. And I’m a chemist, where everything I work with is nice and inanimate and won’t do anything until I mess with it — animal handling is ten times worse.

If almost everyone gets that practical experience when they’re kids, these guys are going to be significantly behind the curve, and their competitiveness in the international field is going to be completely shot. Moreover, even if you can find an in-universe justification for this, it’s really confusing for the people reading who are used to the games’ setup, especially since the games’ setup is a lot simpler. Like, why are you asking us for full teams if all their pokemon are… what, rentals? “Friends”, whatever that means? Are these pokemon they’re going to catch in the future? Except you also had a section saying that in-story captures are going to be through a different format. I have no idea what you want!

You asked why I dislike SYOCs. There are multiple reasons, but I can tell you one now: this. Dealing with authors who have a grand vision of some unique setting but who can’t articulate it well enough for me to make a character that fits. And I can’t even blame them, because of course it’s hard to explain your entire world and all your thoughts and feelings on what’s compatible and what isn’t, especially if you don’t want to spoil the story. This is why I kept telling you to just make your own characters. This format is inherently flawed.

Aug 3“Oh okay, end of the first section, I see it now. Can’t believe I missed that, I would have given you hell for it. I’ll just have to make up for lost time.”

You can’t give me Hell because I have enough experience with it to rule it.

“Evidently they would if we were in the Pokemon universe. Clearly, the pokeworld isn’t as dangerous as our own. It doesn’t matter how strange a fictional cultural value looks from our standpoint, this is objectively how it works in this world. There has to be an internal logic to every fantasy setting — that is their “realistic”. Rampantly injecting our “realistic” is going to look unrealistic in the context of the world. There’s no way you can convince me Novus isn’t the laughingstock of the world if this is what its best trainers look like. Even the Unovan and Kalosian kids, who start older, will have a leg up on the graduates by the time they’re the seniors’ age. Practical knowledge is more important than theoretical knowledge, in every field, every time.

Look, I don’t know how old you are, but if you’ve ever done an internship for a technical field, you will know exactly what I’m talking about. It doesn’t matter how good your school is or what you think you know. Actually applying your knowledge is a totally different skill you have to build separately. When I first entered a real lab I was a complete buffoon — even though I took lab courses! My teachers had told me what a lab looked like and what all the tools were and common techniques used. I still had to put in a lot of practice (and constantly badger my supervisor with questions) before I could work efficiently, and I’m still learning. And I’m a chemist, where everything I work with is nice and inanimate and won’t do anything until I mess with it — animal handling is ten times worse.

If almost everyone gets that practical experience when they’re kids, these guys are going to be significantly behind the curve, and their competitiveness in the international field is going to be completely shot. Moreover, even if you can find an in-universe justification for this, it’s really confusing for the people reading who are used to the games’ setup, especially since the games’ setup is a lot simpler. Like, why are you asking us for full teams if all their pokemon are… what, rentals? “Friends”, whatever that means? Are these pokemon they’re going to catch in the future? Except you also had a section saying that in-story captures are going to be through a different format. I have no idea what you want!

You asked why I dislike SYOCs. There are multiple reasons, but I can tell you one now: this. Dealing with authors who have a grand vision of some unique setting but who can’t articulate it well enough for me to make a character that fits. And I can’t even blame them, because of course it’s hard to explain your entire world and all your thoughts and feelings on what’s compatible and what isn’t, especially if you don’t want to spoil the story. This is why I kept telling you to just make your own characters. This format is inherently flawed.”

I’m [REDACTED, but adult]. I asked for full teams to know what Pokemon they’ll catch on their journey. Any other questions? Also, are you serious about Havan being in the story or did you send him without any interest in the story?
Anymore questions?
Your view is you view. My view is my view. I will not stop writing the story just because it is ‘flawed’ in your view – I accept it has flaws and is not perfect but there are many people looking forward to it. If you want to discourage me from writing this story, it’s no use trying – it won’t happen.
Also, answer – are you serious about Havan being a part of it or not? Cause if you are only playing around, then you’re hurting me and a lot of other readers who’re serious about this.

Aug 3Do you seriously think I filled out four pages of excruciatingly detailed information just to prank you? Yes, my submission is serious. Regardless, I give this character to you freely. If you like him, use him and make him your own.

[Your view is you view. My view is my view.]

Okay, but I said why I hold my view and you didn’t. If you don’t want to argue, just say you don’t want to argue instead of quoting the whole section like you’re gonna reply to it.

[I asked for full teams to know what Pokemon they’ll catch on their journey.]

Thank you, yes, that’s the information I needed. You should state that more clearly on the form.

In that case, his team will have to have a different theme to it. Let’s see…

Pokemon No. 2: We can still have hatched pokemon, right? Eevee, “Umbra”. Ability: Adaptability/Sychronize.
She is cheerful, friendly, and enthusiastic, and she loves her trainer! He gives her the best food and grooming and massages all the time. This is the life! She’d do anything for him. (Havan plans to evolve her into an umbreon, as which point he will stop doting on her immediately. What? You expect him to keep up that work after he gets what he wants from her? Umbra will never forgive him for this; she will warn other pokemon of his shallowness, throw important battles, and generally sabotage him at every opportunity.)

Pokemon No. 3: Ralts. Her name is Cruelty. Havan calls her Athena, and plans to evolve her into a gardevoir. Ability: Synchronize
There is something very, very wrong with her: unlike most ralts, she seeks out hostility rather than fearing it, and delights in battle and hurting others. While other ralts fled before Havan’s contempt and powerlust, she was drawn to it. She will obey Havan as long as he can satisfy her bloodlust, but as she becomes stronger, she will become harder to control. Other psychics, especially ralts, are terrified of her.

Pokemon No. 4: Audino. Her name is Judgment-of-God. Havan calls her Freyja. Ability: Healer
She was highly respected among her group in the wild for her ability to deliver both justice and mercy. She has extremely good special attack for an audino, and can use the move Thunderbolt with amazing power, as if she is calling down the wrath of the gods. In turn, she is a very capable healer, and is drawn to people in need. However, she is not content to be the portable medpack Havan intends her to be; she is very willful, energetic, and extraverted. She’ll obey Havan’s orders in something as meaningless as a battle, but she doesn’t see why she needs this human to help her do her job. She will frequently wander off to talk to other pokemon and find people in need of her services. Havan loves to flaunt her as a badge of goodness, but secretly he’s looking to trade her for a more manageable pokemon. (Additionally, the wild audino of the region are not pleased that Havan took her away. They will spurn him at every turn, and he will never again know the light of their mercy.)

Pokemon No. 5: Machamp. I don’t believe I need to change this? He can get him in a trade at any point. Ability… I’ll say Guts.

Pokemon No. 6: I want to replace the dratini with a gabite. Her name is Sypak. Havan calls her Jormungandr. Ability: Sand Veil
Sypak is very friendly and polite, but also rather withdrawn and anxious. Her previous trainer caught her in Sinnoh, traveled to Novus, and got killed in a landslide. Her pokeball shattered and she was released unharmed, but stranded in an unfamiliar land. After a period of aimless and increasingly panicked exploring on her own, she will encounter Havan and try to convince him to take her home. He’ll get the gist of it… but he has no plans of actually delivering on his promise. Who in their right mind would just give up such a rare and lucky find? He’s sure she’ll come around. If she just travels with him a little longer, surely she’ll forget all about her home and understand her real purpose in life is helping him achieve his dreams.

23h ago“Do you seriously think I filled out four pages of excruciatingly detailed information just to prank you? Yes, my submission is serious. Regardless, I give this character to you freely. If you like him, use him and make him your own.”

You should be happy I’m not a tsundere.

“Okay, but I said why I hold my view and you didn’t. If you don’t want to argue, just say you don’t want to argue instead of quoting the whole section like you’re gonna reply to it.”

If I argue will you try to understand it?

“Thank you, yes, that’s the information I needed. You should state that more clearly on the form.”

. . . . . You’re the only one that didn’t understand but I apologize.

Okay, I’ll make the Pokemon changes. Also, we need to discuss his Ability in more detail (An Ability is NOT a supernatural power – it is actually heightened human senses).

23h ago[If I argue will you try to understand it?]

Yes.

[You’re the only one that didn’t understand]

Perhaps I was the only one who wanted to make a character with an established team. It’s understandable not to consider all possibilities, but you do need to be explicit about what you want and lock out potential misunderstandings.

[Also, we need to discuss his Ability in more detail (An Ability is NOT a supernatural power – it is actually heightened human senses).]

Okay, explain more.

23h agoAlso, I forgot but Ralts is unavailable. She was already selected by two trainers. You’ll have to change Athena.
23h agoOH WAIT IGNORE THAT. It wasn’t meant for you.
23h agoIf the other two have equally good thematic justifications for giving their OC an overused pokemon, I will.
23h ago?

23h ago“Yes.”

Maybe later, when we’re done with everything.

“Perhaps I was the only one who wanted to make a character with an established team. It’s understandable not to consider all possibilities, but you do need to be explicit about what you want and lock out potential misunderstandings.”

You weren’t but like I said, I apologize.

“Okay, explain more.”

I have a suggestion for Silver Tongue – instead of only ‘swaying’ humans, Havan can literally make people like him to the point of almost blind trust which also halves the attack of rival Trainers who battle him because of their liking for him. This makes them unwilling to defeat him and some even throw the battle in his favor. However, the con is that Silver Tongue has the opposite affect on Pokemon – it makes them greatly dislike Havan and be more fierce towards him and his Pokemon. So in the end, people love him, Pokemon hate him. Battle effects are more or less balanced though.

23h agoThat sounds pretty supernatural.

[Silver Tongue has the opposite affect on Pokemon – it makes them greatly dislike Havan and be more fierce towards him and his Pokemon.]

That completely defeats the point of what I was trying to go for. He absolutely can make pokemon like him if he put as much effort into it as he does with humans; that’s what I showed with the first team I submitted. He just doesn’t, because he doesn’t think it’s necessary.

Honestly, I’m pretty weirded out by the concept of giving characters such mechanical abilities like this — like I said, this isn’t a video game. Charisma isn’t actually meant to be his prime skill anyway, it’s just a means to an end.

If you want something that affects battles… hm. How about we literalize the turn-based nature of RPGs? Havan is a very fast thinker and has more time to analyze his surroundings and make effective tactical decisions in crisis situations.

11h agoYou haven’t watched Death Note, have you? And it’s NOT supernatural – it’s just heightened charisma.

But if it doesn’t suit him then okay. And hmmmmmm . . . . . good idea but there are already OCs who have those abilities.

Wanna hear about Ultimate Luck?

3h agoLuck is also unsuitable to him. His whole thing is that he hates the concept of luck and serendipity; he thinks people only ever deserve things if they put in the effort for it.

Look, how about he just doesn’t have an ability? That would fit with the idea of him as the unchosen one — he’s not the hero, he has no divine favor uplifting him or harrying him or caring about him at all. He’s a totally neutral spec with no inherent advantages or disadvantages.

3h agoOh, hah, can background advantages count? Wealthy Parents. He has effectively infinite material resources.

1h agoWELL we’ll just have to think something up!!!!! The 15 OCs NEED to have an ability but I can’t tell you why since it’s a major spoiler!!!!!!! We’ll just need to find an Ability that fits Havan!!!!

. . . . . 35% of the characters are wealthy.

I WILL find a suitable ability for him even if that’s the last thing I do!!!

Hmmmmm . . . . .

GOT ONE!!!

How about ‘Sensitivity’? This ability basically allows Havan to sense the potential and power in a person or a Pokemon – their limits, their weaknesses, their specialties, how strong they are etc. However, to know that, Havan needs to get to at least an ‘acquaintance’ degree of closeness to those people or Pokemon – which is a piece of cake for him.

29m agoThat’s supernatural, but fine, it’s a good enough fit. (A bit like how you’re able to see your pokemon’s stats in the games.) Limit it to just pokemon, though; a big part of Havan is that he has trouble understanding other people, so it wouldn’t fit thematically to include humans.
20m agoDone.
Also, since the first guy seems to be busy, I’ll move on to you – Which Starter would you like? (You can basically choose from any of the Gen I to Gen V Starters but choose two in your order of preference – just in case the other guy wants one of them)
17m agoCharmander. Havan likes dragons.
16m agoOne more. Just in case Guy 1 chooses Charmander too.
14m agoOh, sorry. Snivy.

The next chapter has an author’s note thanking me for reviewing, so they clearly didn’t learn their lesson about passive aggression.

Aug 4[I’d like to thank cookiecastlequeen, Naru Nanigoto, confections101, bladewielder05, TheStuffILike, Cloak192, X3rn345, The Gaming Geek Gina, St Elmo’s Fire and HIKAGE-SAMA for their supportive and constructive reviews!]

Why, thank you! I’m sure you wouldn’t mind another, then?

1h ago-_-; As long as they aren’t flames or misunderstandings or baseless assumptions, I’d welcome one like I’d welcome cake.
22m agoI can definitely guarantee I will not do any of those things by my own definition of the terms.
17m ago‘By my own definition of terms.’
That doesn’t sound very welcoming.
14m agoIt’s a necessary disclaimer. Intending something does not make it so. If you interpret my words differently than I intended, I can’t very well control that, can I? All I can do is give you my word that I’m acting in good faith.
12m agoWell, at least ‘try’ to sound encouraging.

https://www.fanfiction.net/s/12593617/2/PoKeMoN-D-E-M-O-N-A-N-D-A-N-G-E-L

[I’d like to thank cookiecastlequeen, Naru Nanigoto, confections101, bladewielder05, TheStuffILike, Cloak192, X3rn345, The Gaming Geek Gina, St Elmo’s Fire and HIKAGE-SAMA for their supportive and constructive reviews!]

You’re welcome!

You wouldn’t capitalize animal or mouse or dragon, so you shouldn’t capitalize words like pokemon or pikachu or charizard. The only time you should capitalize it is if you’re using it as the pokemon’s name, ie, Ash’s pikachu is called Pikachu. This is because you only capitalize when it’s a proper noun, which are the names of places or things. Similar reasoning should be applied to any other words you’re thinking of capitalizing, like telephone or trainer. Or professor. Or angel. Or king. Before you message me about this, please look at fanfiction (d o t) net/topic/11834/55376155/1/Capitalization-Thread to make sure your argument hasn’t already been addressed.

[Havan D Rath – “The Destined Hero”]

[(some of you may ask ‘what are those fancy names?’ *evil smile* Well, that’s for me to know and for you to figure out! Huehuehuehuehue . . . .)]

Sounds pretty important, then. That you’ve already such an important decision regarding the characters without consulting the submitters worries me. But I will reserve full judgment until we learn the purpose of the names.

[Voiced By:]

[Opening Song (OP 1) – Tragedy: Eternity by MYTH & ROID]

I direct your own question to me back at you: are you taking this seriously? This is a prose story, not a screenwriting.

[“This is a legend . . . . of a long time ago.”]

Ellipses are always three dots, never more or less. Spacing them out also looks really weird in formats that don’t allow double spacing, such as here.

[the Heavens]

“Heaven” is only capitalized if it refers to the singular place. General heavens are uncapitalized.

[They were illuminated in a pale, amber glow but the lack of light left their distinct features in an ambiguous shadow.]

This needs a comma after “glow”. You have many other errors like this, and it makes some sentences hard to follow. You need to read up on proper comma usage, and maybe get a beta reader to help you.

[I think I surprised everyone – mother]

When a title (such as “mom” or “dad”) is used in place of a name, it’s capitalized like one.

[It took Camilla major effort to compose herself before she continued “I-I-I-I ship them]

This needs a comma after “continued”. You’re formatting dialogue incorrectly. Dialogue is written as [“Hello,” she said] or [“Hello!” she said], never [“Hello.” She said] or [“Hello”, she said] or [“Hello” she said]. This is because dialogue and speech tags are considered to be part of the same sentence, so they have to flow together. The only exception to this is if the next sentence doesn’t contain a speech verb. In that case, the second part IS considered a separate sentence, so it’s written as [“Hello.” She grinned], never [“Hello,” she grinned]. Note that something isn’t a speech verb just because it’s a sound you make with your mouth, so generally stuff like “laughed” or “giggled” is in the second category. (“Speak” is also not a speech verb.) Furthermore, if you’re breaking up two complete sentences it’s [“Hi,” she said. “This is it.”] not [“Hi,” she said, “this is it.”] or [“Hi,” she said “this is it.”] And if you’re breaking up a sentence in the middle, it’s [“Hi. This,” she said, “is it.”] The same punctuation and capitalization rules apply to thoughts, except you don’t use quotation marks (or single quotes) with thoughts. This is because quotation marks for thoughts make it look like your characters are talking out loud, which is confusing to the reader.

Hm.

While this is certainly meaty enough for a prologue, it feels a bit scattered. Your portrayal of the kids being brats is very realistic, but that just reminds me of all the brattiness I have to put up with in real life, and is therefore just really grating and tiring. It also drowns out the parts of the scene that are important because the idiot children are screaming over the saintly main character introverts. There is probably a better way to communicate how chaotic Esther’s home life is than having the kids chatter on and on and on about nothing.

re: Your review to PoKeMoN: D E M O N A N D A N G E L

Aug 4A response to your review at https://www.fanfiction.net/r/12593617/

“You wouldn’t capitalize animal or mouse or dragon, so you shouldn’t capitalize words like pokemon or pikachu or charizard. The only time you should capitalize it is if you’re using it as the pokemon’s name, ie, Ash’s pikachu is called Pikachu. This is because you only capitalize when it’s a proper noun, which are the names of places or things. Similar reasoning should be applied to any other words you’re thinking of capitalizing, like telephone or trainer. Or professor. Or angel. Or king. Before you message me about this, please look at fanfiction (d o t) net/topic/11834/55376155/1/Capitalization-Thread to make sure your argument hasn’t already been addressed.”

I don’t need to see it because I’m not gonna argue – I don’t really care about the ‘right’ or ‘wrong’ way as long as my story is understandable and interesting. I’ll use the first letters as capital, thank you very much.

“Sounds pretty important, then. That you’ve already such an important decision regarding the characters without consulting the submitters worries me. But I will reserve full judgment until we learn the purpose of the names.”

Sheesh, you’re a spoilsport, aren’t you? If I told the submitters, that’d completely spoil the story. Besides, not to brag, but I’m good at understanding characters.

“I direct your own question to me back at you: are you taking this seriously? This is a prose story, not a screenwriting.”

I’m perfectly serious which is why I went to the trouble of finding a suitable song to match the story’s theme – give it a listen if you have free time and try to understand the lyrics. I want to make the story as much anime-ish as possible (hence the voice actors and theme songs and further more things to come).

I agree with your grammatical criticism – I’ll look for a beta if I have the time.

“While this is certainly meaty enough for a prologue, it feels a bit scattered. Your portrayal of the kids being brats is very realistic, but that just reminds me of all the brattiness I have to put up with in real life, and is therefore just really grating and tiring.”

Thank you for the compliment. They were not picture perfect Mary Sues/Gary Stus but realistic, annoying, grating kids who even annoyed you. :3 I’m flattered they were able to influence you in real life.

“It also drowns out the parts of the scene that are important because the idiot children are screaming over the saintly main character introverts. There is probably a better way to communicate how chaotic Esther’s home life is than having the kids chatter on and on and on about nothing.”

All 15 are main characters but believe me, none of them are saintly. And Elmo-san, that is not Esther’s home life – you didn’t read the middle part carefully. -_-

Anyway, thank you for reviewing.

secs ago[as my story is understandable]

That’s exactly why I brought it up. Capitalizing common nouns makes stories less understandable. The purpose of grammar isn’t to split hairs over what’s “right” or “wrong”, it’s to make communication easier.

[Elmo-san]

We’re not speaking Japanese. Don’t co-opt Japanese language and culture. It’s incredibly racist and cringey.

12m ago“That’s exactly why I brought it up. Capitalizing common nouns makes stories less understandable. The purpose of grammar isn’t to split hairs over what’s “right” or “wrong”, it’s to make communication easier.”

I appreciate the advice but I neither agree with it nor accept it.

“We’re not speaking Japanese. Don’t co-opt Japanese language and culture. It’s incredibly racist and cringey.”

It may be cringey but it’s not racist. What do I refer to you as then? Mr. Elmo? Homie? Nigga? Ma’ boy? Holy Saint? SEF? Love?

Also, what kind of role do you want Havan to have? I’m leaning towards a grey or antagonistic role but I’d like to hear your opinion.


…Her main character constantly corrects a toddler’s mispronunciations in this chapter.

secs ago[It may be cringey but it’s not racist.]

I’ve seen an awful lot of tirades from Japanese people who seem to think otherwise.

[What do I refer to you as then?]

I don’t know, maybe my name?

[Also, what kind of role do you want Havan to have?]

Ah, you finally ask the only important SYOC question. Most people don’t, so perhaps you’re a bar above the rest.

Havan is a dark mirror. When he asks, “What makes you so different?” that is not a rhetorical question. It is a challenge. I want you to really think about that question, and to have an answer by the end. Try to prove him wrong. How you go about doing that is up to you, but I think he works best in a subtle role. Make him look like a real hero, the better to sweep the rug out from people later. Use his behavior to reflect and further the theme.

Aug 4“I’ve seen an awful lot of tirades from Japanese people who seem to think otherwise.”

My best friend is Japanese and shamelessly promotes suffix usage amongst other things. But yes, there are different people out there.

“I don’t know, maybe my name?”

. . . . . Which is? Saint? Elmo? Fire? Saint Elmo? Elmo Fire? Saint Fire? SEF? Or your elusive real name?

“Ah, you finally ask the only important SYOC question. Most people don’t, so perhaps you’re a bar above the rest.”

It is important but not the ‘only’ important question. Would Havan truly be Havan if he was named Billy and had black hair and was middle-class?
Thank you for the compliment but I’ve never read an SYOC on this site so I don’t know how good they are.

“Havan is a dark mirror. When he asks, “What makes you so different?” that is not a rhetorical question. It is a challenge. I want you to really think about that question, and to have an answer by the end. Try to prove him wrong. How you go about doing that is up to you, but I think he works best in a subtle role. Make him look like a real hero, the better to sweep the rug out from people later. Use his behavior to reflect and further the theme.”

Understood.
One more question – how fitting would he be as a misguided antagonist?

Aug 5[Thank you for the compliment but I’ve never read an SYOC on this site so I don’t know how good they are.]

Seriously? You acted so confident that you were SURE your story would avoid all the pitfalls and how dare I think otherwise and this is your first rodeo? If you want to make it as a writer, you shouldn’t ignore other peoples’ experience.

[Would Havan truly be Havan if he was named Billy and had black hair and was middle-class?]

Yes. What matters about a character is what purpose they serve in the narrative. All else is trappings to help them serve that role. Perhaps in a different story, he would more effectively serve his role that way.

[how fitting would he be as a misguided antagonist?]

Havan isn’t misguided. He knows full well what he’s doing. He pretty much has to ultimately be an antagonist, but he’s a nonstandard one. He doesn’t have to directly oppose the heroes until it becomes clear there can be only one and that one is not him. In game terms, I guess he’d fulfill the role of a rival? Or Alder, heh. Someone who constantly shows up to steal the spotlight from you in every cutscene while all the NPCs swoon over how awesome he is.

But you’re missing the forest for the trees. Just do whatever accomplishes the theme I talked about. The specific role to use for that will change depending on the narrative, and since you keep refusing to tell me anything about the narrative, I can’t help you there.

8h ago“Seriously? You acted so confident that you were SURE your story would avoid all the pitfalls and how dare I think otherwise and this is your first rodeo? If you want to make it as a writer, you shouldn’t ignore other peoples’ experience.”

I was NEVER sure my story would avoid all pitfalls – Lol, why’d you think so? Anyway, if you have any suggestions, be free to tell me.

“Yes. What matters about a character is what purpose they serve in the narrative. All else is trappings to help them serve that role. Perhaps in a different story, he would more effectively serve his role that way.”

Hmmmm, you have a point here.

“Havan isn’t misguided. He knows full well what he’s doing. He pretty much has to ultimately be an antagonist, but he’s a nonstandard one. He doesn’t have to directly oppose the heroes until it becomes clear there can be only one and that one is not him. In game terms, I guess he’d fulfill the role of a rival? Or Alder, heh. Someone who constantly shows up to steal the spotlight from you in every cutscene while all the NPCs swoon over how awesome he is.

But you’re missing the forest for the trees. Just do whatever accomplishes the theme I talked about. The specific role to use for that will change depending on the narrative, and since you keep refusing to tell me anything about the narrative, I can’t help you there.”

I TOLD YOU IT’D BE SPOILERS – TRY TO UNDERSTAND PLEASE.

But that reference helps a lot. I was planning a similar role for him.

8h agoOh, and I’ll be needing the same basic info and stats for your Charmander.
31m agoYou’re not making a video game. Asking for stats in a prose story is ridiculous.
5m agoI need them to compare the stats between the Starters and calculate outcomes of fights.
4m agoGod, just send them.

secs agoOrrr you could… calculate outcomes based on what makes a better story, like everyone else?

For someone who hates being told what to do, you sure do love telling people to write your story for you. I could not care less what the stats are. Make them yourself.

31m agoI CAN MAKE A BETTER STORY FROM ALL KINDS OF OUTCOMES.

I need the details NIGGUH. DETAILS.

I
NEED
THEM
TO
CREATE
A
STORY
EVERYONE
CAN
ENJOY

secs ago[I CAN MAKE A BETTER STORY FROM ALL KINDS OF OUTCOMES. ]

Then prove it. I give you complete control over this aspect. Astound me with your creative skill.

Every other author seems to do just fine without literal stats for their pokemon, and without their readers spoonfeeding them every tiny detail. You’re not doing a good job of convincing me this story is going to succeed.

But if you’re really that creatively bankrupt, I will magnanimously provide you with the suggestion to allocate the stats perfectly equally.

First “-san”, now “nigguh”. They are really going for broke with Racist Bingo.

7m agoOh Lord Immature Brat, King of Brutish Men, First of the Judgemental and the Savior of Moronic Dolts, please give me the stats and other info on your Charmander.

2m ago[Lord Immature Brat]

Says the person who throws a fit when I give them one iota of responsibility? If you want me to treat you with respect, act like an adult.

Anyway, I already did. Allocate them perfectly equally, 12.5 in each stat.

Really though, I’m genuinely curious about this. Why don’t you want to allocate the stats yourself?

secs agoOh, you want the ability too, I presume. Blaze, obviously. Nickname is “Yahweh”.

16m ago“Says the person who throws a fit when I give them one iota of responsibility? If you want me to treat you with respect, act like an adult.”

A few words. ‘Do unto others what you want others to do unto you.’

“Anyway, I already did. Allocate them perfectly equally, 12.5 in each stat.”

THANK YOU.

“Really though, I’m genuinely curious about this. Why don’t you want to allocate the stats yourself?”

To respect the preferences of the creators and one more reason I can’t tell you.

“Oh, you want the ability too, I presume. Blaze, obviously. Nickname is “Yahweh”.”

Thanks. And personality, food habits and relationship with Havan?

1m ago[A few words. ‘Do unto others what you want others to do unto you.’]

Yes, precisely. I’ve never violated this precept. You’re the one who came out swinging. I acknowledge my review was blunt. That’s not an excuse to respond with maximum hostility. If you had specific objections or concerns about my points, you should have given me rational counterarguments instead of throwing a tantrum.

[To respect the preferences of the creators]

I can understand this perspective, except I explicitly said my preference was to not have to jump through this hoop.

[one more reason I can’t tell you]

Can you still not see what a huge obstacle this is for co-writing?

Everything else I already provided in my initial submission, but I’ll repeat it: “As a lab-raised pokemon, they had very little contact with the outside world until Havan came along, and they are eternally grateful that he gave them a purpose. Born and raised for battle, they’re highly skilled and intelligent, but this can make them come off as snobbish and aloof towards other pokemon.”

53m ago“Yes, precisely. I’ve never violated this precept. You’re the one who came out swinging. I acknowledge my review was blunt. That’s not an excuse to respond with maximum hostility. If you had specific objections or concerns about my points, you should have given me rational counterarguments instead of throwing a tantrum.”

Blunt is an understatement in both literal and figurative terms. And I did not respond with maximum hostility or throw a tantrum but I cannot change the way a person interprets something so feel free.

“I can understand this perspective, except I explicitly said my preference was to not have to jump through this hoop.”

I still do need the most minimal of detailed info.

“Can you still not see what a huge obstacle this is for co-writing?”

. . . . Since when were we ‘co-writing’?

“Everything else I already provided in my initial submission, but I’ll repeat it: “As a lab-raised pokemon, they had very little contact with the outside world until Havan came along, and they are eternally grateful that he gave them a purpose. Born and raised for battle, they’re highly skilled and intelligent, but this can make them come off as snobbish and aloof towards other pokemon.”

Thank you.

secs ago[. . . . Since when were we ‘co-writing’?]

Since you asked people to make a part of the story for you. Co-writers don’t need to have equal contributions; even if someone does something as minor as contribute one character, they are a co-writer. Normally I wouldn’t describe SYOC fics this way, but you are asking an awful lot from us in these submissions. Also, you did just lock up when I told you to use your own creativity for something unbelievably minor and insignificant, so.

[And I did not respond with maximum hostility or throw a tantrum]

How would you describe your actions, then?

This was followed with dead silence. After a month, I poked them for an update.

Sep 16So how’s this coming along?

This still got nothing, but a month later, they deleted the story and wiped their profile. Further inquiries have yielded nothing. I even Googled their username to see if they made a forum post, but nothing turned up. I have no clue what happened — perhaps SYOC did prove to be to much for them, or maybe some real life drama interfered. It is a mystery.

What a disappointment. I had such high hopes for this one, too.

So yes, this is another reason why I hate SYOC. They require so much effort just to get your foot in the door, and then nine times out of ten, they evaporate before you see any payoff. Stop deleting your stories, people.

8 Comments

  1. APen says:

    I just don’t get the impulse behind SYOC stories. Making up characters is the fun part of a story; actually writing those character in a functional plot is where the work is. So why do people want to do all the work without any of the fun that is character creation?

     

     

    1
    1. Act says:

      Reviews, generally. Submissions in reviews bumps the count, and then readers want to come back and see their character, so you have a built-in fanbase. In practice people don’t care and then the writer gets bored, but the idea is reviews.

      4
      1. St. Elmo's Fire says:

        I also suspect laziness and lack of creativity. This isn’t the only time an author has freaked out when faced with filling in some minor gaps on a submission. They want people to write their story for them.

    2. Negrek says:

      For me, it would be the challenge of trying to create a coherent narrative with a random grab-bag of characters other people threw my way. Sort of the same principle as those writing challenges that ask you to incorporate some set of specific words, or to write about whatever object’s nearest you, etc. Improv writing, kinda.

      I wouldn’t want to do a big long story for that kind of a silly, fun exercise, though, which unfortunately clashes with what most people submitting characters expect. (But if I wanted to use more than just a couple characters it’d probably be pretty long, anyway, so really the nature of the exercise kind of pulls away from the short, contained work I’d want to create.)

      1
      1. St. Elmo's Fire says:

        This is why the character bio thread is a much better venue for this thing.

        1. Negrek says:

          Well, I don’t really enjoy filling out character bios (or “creating characters” as such, I don’t generally do that), so it’s not for me tbh. Unless you mean that would be a better place to look for charactes to smash together, rather than asking for them?

          wordpress really are you only going to remember me for like two days, come on

    3. CrazyEd says:

      [The top 15 students will be divided into five groups of three members each and leave on different routes – however, each student will have the same goal. Collect eight badges and take the League challenge – the top four finalists will battle the Elite Four and the winners will then proceed to battle each other before finally making it to the Champion. The teams will have to travel on their journey together and will be out of the competition if they leave their team or travel alone.]

      They want to run a pen and paper RPG, but don’t know such things still exist, from the sound of this.

      4
    4. Keleri says:

      Yeah, reviews. Also as a teenager I thought that I was doing everyone a favor by giving their characters a little cameo in my story, since it was something that my buddies traded back and forth. However, it ended up hugely backfiring on me because everyone who submitted their OC basically wanted me to write a story for them where their OC was, if not the star, pretty close to it. WHOOPS

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